The thing is, astronomy research has no inherent profit in it. The work astronomers do can (and often does) eventually have a strong impact on human technology and society but, at the time the scientists are still doing it? Not really.
Astronomy research is not done for profit and frequently involves collaborations which straight up ignore national borders and political matters, focusing on acquiring knowledge and sharing it freely.
Honestly, capitalists hate it.
And yes, astronomy in particular, shares most of the knowledge it finds freely with anyone who wants it.
All major observatories have a freely searchable database. NASA, being publicly funded, have a policy of releasing all their data into the public domain as soon as its received.
Nearly all astronomy researchers put freely accessible copies of their published work on the internet for anyone to see, at https://arxiv.org/archive/astro-ph
The Event Horizon Telescope, incidentally, is a fantastic example of a large scale decentralised non-governmental collaboration.
That black hole image was taken using 8 separately managed radio telescopes scattered across the planet. It was organised by scientists working in 60 different research institutes in 17 countries across 6 continents. With no motive beyond trying to learn something which they didn't know before.
Tell that to anyone who tries to argue that humans don't accomplish anything unless motivated by profit.
The profit motive is incredibly demeaning. Like, I don't make a profit from rasing my jade plant. Somebody just gifted me a jade plant and I take care of it cus it's my little plant child and I have to protecc it.
I've seen that kind of attachment boiled down to "indirect profit" and I'm like "I am wasting perfectly good water on a plant! There are tons of plants outside and they get watered for free! Why should I waste my hard earned mostiure on a little cutting!?"
Indoor plants can help keep the air fresh as well as beautify. So you are seeing a profit, just not going to professional profiteers to get it. :)
Well if that's how you wanna slice it, the jade plant is still a bad choice. It grows very slowly, so to start from a cutting means my investment in care and water has been a massive drain compared to the output of my precious child.
I'd want plant that produces more than it intakes, and one that has a faster reproductive cycle so I can make more from my intital investment.
I am losing at greenhouse capitalism, and hard.
I only have air plants and hanging Devil's Ivy now. Our late, great orange monster finished off all the rest, including my fabulous jade. (She didn't try to eat it, just played Gravity with it one time too many.)
I keep my jade plant up on the window seal where the pups can't reach. Also, my pups only steal food, and usually only things that smell like meat.
@xenophora @Roxxie_Riot
I think I’d call that a benefit, not a profit...
@InvaderXan Profit doesn't necessarily mean money. ;)
@SeventhMagpie
The way I see it, profit is all about financial gain, but everything else is value and benefit. Though maybe that’s an English dialect thing...
@InvaderXan Ah, probably! I keep forgetting. :)
The way the word "profit" is usually translated into Russian can mean both material and non-material benefit, depending on a context. Although we do have a separate word for financial gain as well.
@SeventhMagpie
Oh, that’s interesting. I guess technically, “profit” can have that meaning in English too. But no one uses it that way, in my experience.
@InvaderXan though it's not really "non-governmental" if the governments made the decision to fund the research institutes
@zalandocalrissian
Without public funding, none of us would get paid, and we’d all have to find different jobs. However, the collaboration itself is neither made between governments, nor organised by them.
does this mean my silly idealistic dream of "grassroots research" with micro cells of academics working different aspects of problems and newcomers working with them on other aspects, with the whole world becoming a more interconnected sort of "citizen scientist planet" situation, is a thing?
please let that be a thing it could be pretty friggin' awesome c'moooooooon
@sydneyfalk
You know, notwithstanding it’s systemic problems and shortcomings, this sounds to me like the way academia is ideally supposed to work...
@sydneyfalk
Dreaming is good, chérie. Try not to let the world stop you from dreaming.
that's a lovely sentiment ^_^ thank you
@InvaderXan one of my introductions to this kind of cooperation was learning from a guy at Kitt Peak that they have a small remote operated telescope belonging to a scandinavian university - a university that has telescopes around the world so their students can do observing 24/7. Just these boxes about the size of the utility boxes next to buildings (maybe 3x3x5'). One of the coolest things I've heard about.
@LilFluff
Observatories are always interesting that way. In South Africa, one of the observatory caretakers showed me around a few similar sounding things one afternoon...
@InvaderXan A note that the technology used by astronomers can also have other (practical) applications.
Here's a recent example: "An X-ray machine which uses space technology to generate crystal clear images that doctors can use to detect the early signs of cancer"
@sohkamyung
Oh, very interesting. I had t heard about this one, thanks!
@InvaderXan The thing is, no scientific research has any inherent profit to it. You have to go through huge handflips, and set up truly tyrannical laws, before you can make a profit off of discoveries, which by definition cannot be predicted.
@InvaderXan Though I suppose it’s fair to say astronomy has tended to yield things more slowly than other disciplines like chemistry.
@InvaderXan I’d probably be working in organic chemistry if I’d made it through college, but thankfully that didn’t happen! Still, it’s fascinating stuff, even if it’s… being used in horribly unethical ways.
@cy
I’m fairness, organic chem isn’t universally bad. There’s a lot of good stuff being researched too. You just have to be careful who you work for.
@InvaderXan Some of the ideas they’ve had for waste cleanup are pretty fascinating. CO2 scrubbers and methane catalysts and… I dunno I haven’t looked into that stuff in a long time.
@cy
I’m out of touch with that kind of thing too. I should investigate when I have time...
Socially I also love how Astronomy just crosses through cultural and national borders like a Neutrino through normal matter lol.
Like it unites everyone on the Planet because Astronomy looks beyond the Planet we call home.
So it helps bring people together and it isn't owned/controlled by a corporation/government? Yeah, I can see why capitalists hate it.
@Tau_Leonis
One notable example is in East Asia. China’s government bullies everyone else and refuses to even recognise Taiwan as a country. But in East Asian astronomy collaborations, they all stand together.
Scientists from China, Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan were all involved in the Event Horizon Telescope.
This makes me love astronomy even more than I already did, if that was possible.
All those people upset that "we are funding science programs that don't do anything" should save their torches and pitchforks for the military budget. The funding science gets in the US compared to the military is like comparing a glass of water to Lake Superior.
We could improve social services, fund science, and actually LOWER taxes if the imperialists didn't insist on this huge empire budget that doesn't really benefit anyone except defense contractors.
@Tau_Leonis
Most of the military spending in the world comes from the US. They could cut out enough funding to permanently end world hunger and still have the largest military budget in the world.